It´s surprising to hear that

    • Maetani@jlai.lu
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      3 days ago

      What the fuck do you think it means then? Because otherwise everyone, everywhere has the freedom to do everything, but for some of them you don’t have freedom from consequences…

      • HikingVet@lemmy.ca
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        3 days ago

        You are never free from consequences.

        If you paid attention when they were going over free speech (assuming you paid attention in a civics class), it always talks about how the GOVERNMENT can’t tell you not to say something critical of them.

        If you were allowed to say things without any consequences; why are there laws against libel, slander, hate speech, false claims, and inciting violence? To name a few.

        Your concept of free speech does not jive with reality.

        • ryathal@sh.itjust.works
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          3 days ago

          You are free to walk down the streets of Harlem with an “I hate niggers” sign. The law still protects you from assault or other actions that others may take against you. You may get fired from your job for such an action, but even then you would still have the right to pursue a wrongful dismissal case.

          As for libel/slander. First of all, it’s a civil issue, and you won’t be jailed for it. Secondly, in the US it requires a significant burden of proof. A plaintiff must show it was more likely than not that:

          • there were actual damages.
          • the statements were false.
          • the person knew the statements were false.
          • the person intended the statements to be harmful.
            There’s also anti-SLAPP laws which provide additional protection from entities attempting to use a lawsuit to stop speech.
            • ryathal@sh.itjust.works
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              3 days ago

              That you may have to get the justice system involved to support your rights. I suppose you can call that a consequence.

                • holo@lemmy.wtf
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                  3 days ago

                  You were wrong, and he thoroughly showed you how you were wrong.

                  By your logic being black has consequences.

        • Maetani@jlai.lu
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          3 days ago

          Except you are free from some consequences, that’s exactly why there are laws in place, to delimit what you can do without retaliation, and what you cannot.

            • Maetani@jlai.lu
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              3 days ago

              Yes, there are, some fairly harmless, some much more impactfull. Getting a dislike from a comment is a consequence, although very benign. Getting boycotted or banned from a platform is another consequence, which could be quite devastating.

              • HikingVet@lemmy.ca
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                3 days ago

                So you admit that certain types of speech when used have consequences even though free spech exists.

                • Maetani@jlai.lu
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                  3 days ago

                  In a way… I admit that ALL types of free speech when used can have SOME consequences.

                  The issue I have with your original statement is that you put all consequences in the same basket… With that logic you can say that freedom to vote does not mean freedom from consequences, therefore you can’t complain that I try to indimidate anyone if front of the booth

                  • HikingVet@lemmy.ca
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                    3 days ago

                    The issue I have with your argument is you have backtracked on the fact that consequences exist and I never mentioned who would be enforcing said consequences or what they would be.

                    You assumed what I meant, ran with it and now are complaining because you had to shift your position where the original statement I made still holds.

                    I said CONSEQUENCES, not what ones.