Cool. And that makes a difference how exactly? I’m sure dividing Americans into “terrible” and “slightly less terrible” categories is definitely going to solve all their problems.
Agreed but I think the ones who stayed home and actively encouraged others to do the same are worse than Trump voters who keep it to themselves. That Trump voters scored 1 vote and the armchair activist made at least one person not vote
Honest question: how could I have improved the clarity of my comment to avoid it being interpreted as wrong as you did? I’ll rephrase it in bullet points.
A Trump voter who doesn’t preach is 1 vote for Trump
A non-voter who doesn’t preach is 1 vote for Trump
A Trump voter who preaches is at least 1 vote for Trump as they are actively encouraging others to vote for him. Their vote is the 1 plus the people they might influence
A non-voters who preaches is at least 1 vote for Trump as they are actively encouraging others to not vote. Their vote is the 1 plus the people they might influence
So in summary:
People who promoted voting for Trump AND people who promoted not voting are worse than people who quietly voted for Trump. All 3 groups are worse than quiet non-voters.
OC is referring to the non-voting advocates that disappeared from political discussions on Lemmy after the election.
I don’t remember anyone actively encouraging others to not vote. I’m pretty sure people would just openly say “I am not voting” and then be forced to defend themselves, but that’s certainly not the same as trying to convince other people to not vote.
Were you active on Lemmy earlier this year? It was pervasive. I don’t mean posts detailing why you shouldn’t vote, I mean tons of comments saying that if you voted Democrat this election, you supported genocide.
I’m just not sure if it stopped because their contracts ended or because the ruble tanked in value.
tons of comments saying that if you voted Democrat this election, you supported genocide.
Yeah, I believe that too. That isn’t the same as telling people not to vote. If you believe you have to vote for genocide to stop a greater genocide then more power to you, but you aren’t allowed to pretend you didn’t vote for genocide.
I’m just not sure if it stopped because their contracts ended or because the ruble tanked in value.
Maybe you didn’t know this, but the election ended.
Ya know what, you’re right! Shaming people for voting is not the exact same thing as directly instructing them not to vote. That is a super important distinction that absolutely changes their role in getting other people not to vote.
It also seems I was wrong about those commenters disappearing after the election. It was my fault to assume that they had a solution to propose. I wasn’t considering how hard that would be to find in total darkness with their heads up their asses.
You’ve defeated me on a technicality so now I must leave this conversation. Farewell!
Until the Democratic Party stops excluding the Bernies of the world, elections like these are what we’re going to get. No one believes Democrats will actually do what they say they’re going to do, not even their own voters.
Until the Democratic Party stops excluding the Bernies of the world
So long as the entire corporate media system is poisoned against even the most mild democratic socialism of a 1980s-style left-liberal, the party isn’t going to do that.
Go back and watch what happened in 2020 when Sanders won Nevada. MSNBC, the “liberal” news outlet had Chris Matthews wailing in fear at the prospect of being lynched in Central Park. FOX News was screeching about how the entire campaign had been infiltrated by Chinese Communists and Hamas Terrorists. I’m amazed Sanders didn’t get the Harvey Milk treatment after he took California.
Bernie Sanders, AOC, and the progressive movement as a whole is entirely at odds with the Amazons and Starbucks and JP Morgan Chases that rule our world. Even in big blue states like New York (in big blue cities like NYC), progressives can’t win the high offices, because the establishment is so nakedly hostile to economic populism. Bernie’s own bright blue home state of Vermont voted in a Republican for governor by a Ba’ath Party 73/21 margin, rather than tolerate another Howard Dean style progressive Dem in that seat.
No one believes Democrats will actually do what they say they’re going to do
I believed him. I believed statements like this paved his road to victory in 2020.
Absolutely.
I’ll admit I voted Biden in 2020, thinking that a cultural win against resurgent American fascism would help turn the tide of history. (I didn’t have any delusions that he’d actually rule as a progressive.)
Four years later, with millions more in poverty, it’s only done the opposite.
I voted for Biden in 2020 wanting to give people a chance to remember they’re human, one timescale hoping that his centrist approach had a chance of fixing government. I voted for him again seeing that he made all the attempts anyone could imagine and was starting to attempt a few more progressive things
Trump is not fit to run the bank in a game of Monopoly, and I would vote against it
No, actually, people who voted for Trump are worse than people who stayed home.
Eh. They’re the same to me.
Both groups are irreedemable losers, just in different ways.
People who support Nazis are basically the same as people that just kind of let Nazis do their thing without lifting a finger.
You won’t lift a finger now that the election is over.
Cool. And that makes a difference how exactly? I’m sure dividing Americans into “terrible” and “slightly less terrible” categories is definitely going to solve all their problems.
By a slight margin.
Agreed but I think the ones who stayed home and actively encouraged others to do the same are worse than Trump voters who keep it to themselves. That Trump voters scored 1 vote and the armchair activist made at least one person not vote
Ah I see: A vote for Trump is one vote for Trump, but not voting for Trump is two votes for Trump.
Honest question: how could I have improved the clarity of my comment to avoid it being interpreted as wrong as you did? I’ll rephrase it in bullet points.
A Trump voter who doesn’t preach is 1 vote for Trump
A non-voter who doesn’t preach is 1 vote for Trump
A Trump voter who preaches is at least 1 vote for Trump as they are actively encouraging others to vote for him. Their vote is the 1 plus the people they might influence
A non-voters who preaches is at least 1 vote for Trump as they are actively encouraging others to not vote. Their vote is the 1 plus the people they might influence
So in summary:
People who promoted voting for Trump AND people who promoted not voting are worse than people who quietly voted for Trump. All 3 groups are worse than quiet non-voters.
OC is referring to the non-voting advocates that disappeared from political discussions on Lemmy after the election.
I don’t remember anyone actively encouraging others to not vote. I’m pretty sure people would just openly say “I am not voting” and then be forced to defend themselves, but that’s certainly not the same as trying to convince other people to not vote.
Were you active on Lemmy earlier this year? It was pervasive. I don’t mean posts detailing why you shouldn’t vote, I mean tons of comments saying that if you voted Democrat this election, you supported genocide.
I’m just not sure if it stopped because their contracts ended or because the ruble tanked in value.
Yeah, I believe that too. That isn’t the same as telling people not to vote. If you believe you have to vote for genocide to stop a greater genocide then more power to you, but you aren’t allowed to pretend you didn’t vote for genocide.
Maybe you didn’t know this, but the election ended.
Ya know what, you’re right! Shaming people for voting is not the exact same thing as directly instructing them not to vote. That is a super important distinction that absolutely changes their role in getting other people not to vote.
It also seems I was wrong about those commenters disappearing after the election. It was my fault to assume that they had a solution to propose. I wasn’t considering how hard that would be to find in total darkness with their heads up their asses.
You’ve defeated me on a technicality so now I must leave this conversation. Farewell!
Until the Democratic Party stops excluding the Bernies of the world, elections like these are what we’re going to get. No one believes Democrats will actually do what they say they’re going to do, not even their own voters.
So long as the entire corporate media system is poisoned against even the most mild democratic socialism of a 1980s-style left-liberal, the party isn’t going to do that.
Go back and watch what happened in 2020 when Sanders won Nevada. MSNBC, the “liberal” news outlet had Chris Matthews wailing in fear at the prospect of being lynched in Central Park. FOX News was screeching about how the entire campaign had been infiltrated by Chinese Communists and Hamas Terrorists. I’m amazed Sanders didn’t get the Harvey Milk treatment after he took California.
Bernie Sanders, AOC, and the progressive movement as a whole is entirely at odds with the Amazons and Starbucks and JP Morgan Chases that rule our world. Even in big blue states like New York (in big blue cities like NYC), progressives can’t win the high offices, because the establishment is so nakedly hostile to economic populism. Bernie’s own bright blue home state of Vermont voted in a Republican for governor by a Ba’ath Party 73/21 margin, rather than tolerate another Howard Dean style progressive Dem in that seat.
Joe Biden to rich donors: “Nothing would fundamentally change” if he’s elected
I believed him. I believed statements like this paved his road to victory in 2020.
Absolutely.
I’ll admit I voted Biden in 2020, thinking that a cultural win against resurgent American fascism would help turn the tide of history. (I didn’t have any delusions that he’d actually rule as a progressive.)
Four years later, with millions more in poverty, it’s only done the opposite.
I voted for Biden in 2020 wanting to give people a chance to remember they’re human, one timescale hoping that his centrist approach had a chance of fixing government. I voted for him again seeing that he made all the attempts anyone could imagine and was starting to attempt a few more progressive things
Trump is not fit to run the bank in a game of Monopoly, and I would vote against it